Let's talk front suspension....

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Let's talk front suspension....

Postby ZOSO » Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:23 am

In my adventures to seek more travel and less bind in the front end I ran into trac-bar issues.

I have come to the conclusion that I need atleast 1 heim joint on the trac-bar. I currently have an adjustable one and frame drop bracket. My frame is already plated on both sides and braced so I haven't had issues there but do plan to change to a riser bracket.

So what end should the heim be on? Frame or axle?
Rob

74 Ranger EFI351w, 4r70w, ARB 5.13 9in, ARB 5.13D44, and a bunch of other goodies. Best of all the family memories.

04 Mustang Cobra, KenneBell 2.2 feeding a lot of boost on E85. Tire shredding machine

New project: 77 Bronco Ranger, body work and more body work.

Very little left of a 72 durango tan explorer sport
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Justin » Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:29 am

I put mine on the axle, but I don't think it matters. Jesse would be the one to ask.

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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Gunnibronco » Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:29 am

I added a heim at the frame when I went full width.
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." – Claire Wolfe
74-AWB 98", ZF5, Atlas4, TGW HP1060 and HP1014 axles, ARBs, 37's, 3.5" lift-5.5" front coil springs, Tahoe rear springs, EFI 302, h-boost, York OBA, 4x4x2, custom dash & gauges
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Digger » Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:35 am

For the most part it doesn't matter.

From a dynamics perspective, you should place the rigid joint at the frame end and bushing at the axle end. As the axle oscillates side-to-side relative to the frame, you want the track bar to move with the frame, not the axle. Less dynamic unsprung weight.
Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc.
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby ZOSO » Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:43 am

Digger wrote:For the most part it doesn't matter.

From a dynamics perspective, you should place the rigid joint at the frame end and bushing at the axle end. As the axle oscillates side-to-side relative to the frame, you want the track bar to move with the frame, not the axle. Less dynamic unsprung weight.



Thats what I was hoping for actually. I have the adjustable end at the frame. Want to find a heim that will just screw right into the trac-bar at the top.
Rob

74 Ranger EFI351w, 4r70w, ARB 5.13 9in, ARB 5.13D44, and a bunch of other goodies. Best of all the family memories.

04 Mustang Cobra, KenneBell 2.2 feeding a lot of boost on E85. Tire shredding machine

New project: 77 Bronco Ranger, body work and more body work.

Very little left of a 72 durango tan explorer sport
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Gunnibronco » Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:40 am

The SPC joints have a longer shank than the Ruffstuff & most the other heims I looked at. If that matters.
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." – Claire Wolfe
74-AWB 98", ZF5, Atlas4, TGW HP1060 and HP1014 axles, ARBs, 37's, 3.5" lift-5.5" front coil springs, Tahoe rear springs, EFI 302, h-boost, York OBA, 4x4x2, custom dash & gauges
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Jesus_man » Mon May 01, 2017 11:09 am

Are there other joints that would be better at dampening noise that would work for your application?

But really, in my mind the track bar only travels in one plane, so if your mounts have the bolts running front-back or parallel with the bronco, then it should have all the travel is needs and then I'd run only bushings (which is what I have in mine).

What does the rest of your suspension consist of? A picture?
1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow.
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby ZOSO » Mon May 01, 2017 2:38 pm

Im just running Lars bars on it. and on the install of those the trac-bar was binding the droop. Along with the lower shock mounts. I welded those on the same direction as stock so when flexed out it puts all the twist on the bolts and bushings. I made new lower mounts to weld on when my new shocks get here.

Im just trying to find and eliminate all areas that could cause bind.
Rob

74 Ranger EFI351w, 4r70w, ARB 5.13 9in, ARB 5.13D44, and a bunch of other goodies. Best of all the family memories.

04 Mustang Cobra, KenneBell 2.2 feeding a lot of boost on E85. Tire shredding machine

New project: 77 Bronco Ranger, body work and more body work.

Very little left of a 72 durango tan explorer sport
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Digger » Mon May 01, 2017 3:07 pm

I wouldn't worry about trackbar bushings too much. When 450lbs of axle and tires is hanging off of it, the bushing will deflect.

Are you using poly or rubber?
Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc.
Build Thread: http://www.coloradoclassicbroncos.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5420

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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Jesus_man » Mon May 01, 2017 3:28 pm

Oh, I see what you mean. I wasn't thinking clearly. When one side droops, it puts a torsional load on the track bar bushings. It doesn't seem to hinder mine much. My shocks on the f-250 mounts bottom out first.

I can't seem to find a definitive pic of the lars bars. I can't recall what they do.
1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow.
http://www.ucora.org
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby ZOSO » Mon May 01, 2017 6:17 pm

Lars bars are extended stock arms with a duraflex joint on the frame side.

I'm running poly bushings. I'll leave it be and see how well it all works when the shocks are finished.
Rob

74 Ranger EFI351w, 4r70w, ARB 5.13 9in, ARB 5.13D44, and a bunch of other goodies. Best of all the family memories.

04 Mustang Cobra, KenneBell 2.2 feeding a lot of boost on E85. Tire shredding machine

New project: 77 Bronco Ranger, body work and more body work.

Very little left of a 72 durango tan explorer sport
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Jesus_man » Tue May 02, 2017 9:28 am

Ahh, ok. I did see those. Your limiting factor could be those stock c-bushings. But if you get rid of those, you lose a considerable amount of anti-roll properties.
1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow.
http://www.ucora.org
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Re: Let's talk front suspension....

Postby Justin » Tue May 02, 2017 1:02 pm

Surprisingly, I didn't pick up much body roll with mine.

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