Rear suspension advice

[ScottBarnes]

I’m loaded for Baja and have fairly decent squat that’s going to cause handling issues on the highway. Think about 2 options; add an overload spring or add an air shock on 1 of my 2 rear shocks. If air shock, should I replace the forward or aft?

Advice/suggestions?

[horseplay]

I would use coil over load shocks on the position. Air shocks can be unreliable I've seen a few failures.

[ScottBarnes]

I would use coil over load shocks on the position. Air shocks can be unreliable I've seen a few failures.

Will the coil overloads get my rear end back up? Where would I find those? Is there Anywhere in Denver that can help with those? I was planning on calling Denver Spring and Suspension tomorrow to see if they could put on some overload springs, but a coil over shock sounds like a good plan if it will do the trick.

[71 Broncman]

Have you thought about Air Lift or Firestone load leveler air bags?
Mark.

[ScottBarnes]

Have you thought about Air Lift or Firestone load leveler air bags?
Mark.

Nope -- I've got zero experience with them, but I'll use the almighty google and see what I can find out.

[ZOSO]

Have you thought about Air Lift or Firestone load leveler air bags?
Mark.

That's the route I'd go but be very careful with travel. If you flex it up too much and stretch the airbag it'll tear. The air bag will allow you to adjust the pressure so you can dial it in exactly how you want.

[Jesus_man]

I wonder if you could come up with a design that hangs the air bag from the frame with a contact plate on the axle so they only contact each other when you are loaded down. Then flexing isn't an issue.

Have you driven it this way? I am sure you'll be doing some whoops and the like in the desert, so I'd be more worried about that unless it's just so overloaded that it's squirrelly at speed.

I'm not sure that a shock mount would take the abuse of extra weight, so I too believe airbags would be your best bet.

Another avenue to explore might be a rear sway bar??

[ScottBarnes]

One of the things I found in my googling last night, were these mounts from Daystar http://www.daystarweb.com/productdetail.php?productID=1232 I think it solves the long travel issue. I'm still not sure what bags, etc to match with them or if this is the way I'm going. I have an appointment with Denver Spring and Suspension on Friday morning to let them take a look. It definitely needs to be addressed before Baja, and I'm quickly running out of time.

[Jesus_man]

There ya go! Looks like a great solution that would require a little fabbing to work.

These also might be worth a look, but I'm not sure they are designed to "carry" a load.
http://timbren.com/active-off-road-bumpstops/

[ScottBarnes]

I just got off the phone with Daystar and they were VERY helpful -- these cups are a simple install and can handle up to a 6" dia bag. I made a command decision and ordered a set and they'll be here in a few days. I just need to figure out how to size the bags now.

[Viperwolf1]

For durability down Baja and back I don't think air bags would be a good choice at this time. I've never seen a manufacturers kit designed for the rear of an early Bronco. That means you'll end up with a custom setup that has not been tested, anywhere, ever. I would keep the solution simple. The overload shocks or even short, solid lift blocks would be better.

[ScottBarnes]

For durability down Baja and back I don't think air bags would be a good choice at this time. I've never seen a manufacturers kit designed for the rear of an early Bronco. That means you'll end up with a custom setup that has not been tested, anywhere, ever. I would keep the solution simple. The overload shocks or even short, solid lift blocks would be better.

A lot of the high end racers use the bags, but they've got big teams of smart dudes making it all work. I'm not too afraid of them, but you are probably correct (as usual) in that it's just too close to be doing something custom at this point. I've got the cradles ordered and will probably work on the airbag thing when we get back. We'll see what the guys at Denver Suspension say. My guess is they'll want to throw an overload spring on there and be done with it, which is ok by me at this point.

[Kinder]

I’ve got those 1” blocks I just took off Gunni if you’d like to include them in your option list.

[ScottBarnes]

I’ve got those 1” blocks I just took off Gunni if you’d like to include them in your option list.

this has all of the sudden taken a back seat. Went to start it a few mins ago and I’ve got no fuel pump

[landshark]

let me know what Denver Spring says, i might consider it as well depending on final weight

[ScottBarnes]

let me know what Denver Spring says, i might consider it as well depending on final weight

will do - fuel pump issue resolved, so I’m back on that issue![emoji23]


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[ScottBarnes]

Has anyone ever used these? https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-991?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-hellwig&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqKLo37Kz2gIVx8DICh1EWguyEAQYAiABEgIpBPD_BwE

[MOLLEY]

I have used both ad a leaf and over load coils over shocks both worked for carry load ,the coils over shocks don't hurt flex as much ,I have looked into a air bag { just one in center } but room and size of bag seem like lots of re designing for just 3 times a year that we carry extra load ,

[ZOSO]

Has anyone ever used these? https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-991?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-hellwig&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqKLo37Kz2gIVx8DICh1EWguyEAQYAiABEgIpBPD_BwE

I had these on an old work truck and they didn't last very long before breaking off.

[Kinder]

Did your decide what you are going to do?

In the future when you employ the airbag pads I’d like to be involved as I have similar plans for BSD.

[Digger]

I’m loaded for Baja and have fairly decent squat that’s going to cause handling issues on the highway. Think about 2 options; add an overload spring or add an air shock on 1 of my 2 rear shocks. If air shock, should I replace the forward or aft?

Advice/suggestions?

If you just need a quick solution for Baja, I would go air shocks. Mounting them forward will give you more travel, aft will give more spring assist.

Long term, you would need higher rate springs. I had a similar issue with my rear coils and jumped the rate up 25% in the rear to deal with trailer towing and carrying the whole family. It worked out well and hasn't been a detriment to ride quality.

J.

[ScottBarnes]

Did your decide what you are going to do?

In the future when you employ the airbag pads I’d like to be involved as I have similar plans for BSD.

I’ll know for sure after the appointment in the morning with Denver Spring. Those guys seem to have their stuff together. I received those air bag cradles from Daystar and I’m really intrigued with the potential. We’ll work on this together when I get back and you have some time. FYI - I’m having a lift installed the week after I get back! [emoji12]


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[ScottBarnes]

Has anyone ever used these? https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-991?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-hellwig&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqKLo37Kz2gIVx8DICh1EWguyEAQYAiABEgIpBPD_BwE

I had these on an old work truck and they didn't last very long before breaking off.

[emoji15][emoji15]I cant imagine I could load enough in my Bronco to break those things!


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[ScottBarnes]

I’m loaded for Baja and have fairly decent squat that’s going to cause handling issues on the highway. Think about 2 options; add an overload spring or add an air shock on 1 of my 2 rear shocks. If air shock, should I replace the forward or aft?

Advice/suggestions?

If you just need a quick solution for Baja, I would go air shocks. Mounting them forward will give you more travel, aft will give more spring assist.

Long term, you would need higher rate springs. I had a similar issue with my rear coils and jumped the rate up 25% in the rear to deal with trailer towing and carrying the whole family. It worked out well and hasn't been a detriment to ride quality.

J.

I think you’re right about long term, and that’s what I’m hoping the guys at Denver Spring will help me with when I see them tomorrow. Honestly, I don’t feel ride quality change with different shocks/springs like most guys do. Steering I notice, but ride quality isn’t something I’ve ever noticed. They all ride like 92 inches of wheelbase to me! Lol.


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[millerpz]

Hi, I'm relatively newish around here, but but I believe there is another perspective you really should consider. K.I.S.S. Maybe the problem isn't that your rear suspension is sagging, it's that your asking it to do too much. I cannot think of any aspect of an overloaded vehicle that's really a positive. Handling, safety, reliability.. I just don't see any of those aspects that are really improved with any of the potential solutions that have been suggested. Pack like your going on a long backpack trip using your ingenuity and creativity.

Or steal a little inspiration (probably way easier):

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/jeep-wil ... 503?page=1

This is his build thread, but 2/3rds of the way in he starts talking about his Ultimate Adventure trip. Long story short, his flat fender jeep has nowhere to put stuff and isn't built to carry aloe of weight, so he gets very resourceful about what he and his copilot take with them.

BTW, my experience with Denver Spring is kinda related, by not really. I needed a set of rear leaf spring re-arched to add a little height to my Mustang. The rear Springs were new, but just a touch too low at ride height. The quote I got was $800 off of the car, and double with removal and install. I just couldn't justify spending that to tweak a $300 pair of springs.

[ScottBarnes]

Hi, I'm relatively newish around here, but but I believe there is another perspective you really should consider. K.I.S.S. Maybe the problem isn't that your rear suspension is sagging, it's that your asking it to do too much. I cannot think of any aspect of an overloaded vehicle that's really a positive. Handling, safety, reliability.. I just don't see any of those aspects that are really improved with any of the potential solutions that have been suggested. Pack like your going on a long backpack trip using your ingenuity and creativity.

Or steal a little inspiration (probably way easier):

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/jeep-wil ... 503?page=1

This is his build thread, but 2/3rds of the way in he starts talking about his Ultimate Adventure trip. Long story short, his flat fender jeep has nowhere to put stuff and isn't built to carry aloe of weight, so he gets very resourceful about what he and his copilot take with them.

BTW, my experience with Denver Spring is kinda related, by not really. I needed a set of rear leaf spring re-arched to add a little height to my Mustang. The rear Springs were new, but just a touch too low at ride height. The quote I got was $800 off of the car, and double with removal and install. I just couldn't justify spending that to tweak a $300 pair of springs.

It’s always a fine line when packing for a trip like this. I’m sure we are bringing more than we must, but I weigh that against having the stuff required to get you back to civilization. No right or wrong answer, it’s what feels right for “you”. I’m definitely not asking too much. I think it was stated pretty well by someone that these newer leaf packs are nice for an everyday ride, but give too much under load. That’s the issue I’m addressing. I’ve decided to add another leaf. They also discovered that one set of leafs were riding about an inch higher than the other, and they’ll fix that also. Will end up with a stiffer ride, but as I mentioned, I’m not very sensitive to that anyway. I liked the guys at Denver Spring, and their quote to fix the issue was no where near what they were quoting you. I can’t speak to the quality of work yet, but I’ll know how it all goes by Monday!

[ScottBarnes]

let me know what Denver Spring says, i might consider it as well depending on final weight

adding a leaf.

[landshark]

let me know what Denver Spring says, i might consider it as well depending on final weight

adding a leaf.

thx

[ScottBarnes]

let me know what Denver Spring says, i might consider it as well depending on final weight

adding a leaf.

thx

I’ll call you next week after I load it back up and take it for a spin. I’m pretty sure this is going to solve the issue.

[millerpz]

Yup. It's all about finding the compromise that works for you.

I have had an add a leaf on my old Ranger and now my Explorer. Neither have had a problem with how they worked but I don't haul or tow anything. They are a cheap way to lift the rear on a torsion bar ford, along with a torsion twist in front. They do seem to shorten the leaf springs life. I'm on the 3rd set of explorer leafs now. I just keep an eye on them.

I have heard good things about Denver Spring quality, which is what led me there in the first place. I suspected the quote was off, but found a better solution anyways. I'd go back in the future as no one else local does what they do.