Black Smoke Donkey

[Justin]

Sweet! It's been cool to see your project evolve.

[Colorado75bronc]

Looking good Kirk! Glad to see it coming together for you!

[Jesus_man]

I love it! You are realizing your great vision for this rig!

[Kinder]

Rear window frames complete, '68 style so they'll lift out when not needed. Now to sort out the window regulators.

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[Kinder]

Speaker holes patched. Thanks for the donor door Digger.

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[Colorado75bronc]

Looking good Kirk!

[Justin]

x2! Progress!

[Digger]

Speaker holes patched. Thanks for the donor door Digger.

Nice!

Glad those worked out for you.

[Kinder]

It was bound to happen, I pushed my small bearing 9" just too far since BSD was created, the driver side wheel bearing let go and the passenger side was right behind it. Luckily I was just a couple of miles from home so the hazards were engaged (yes they work!) and I limped home.

I've had a big bearing housing tucked aside with a Warn full float kit, just needed to get the drums opened up, as luck would have it Mike (777mechanic) took care of this for me recently.

I know there are potential problems running this setup, leaks & the likelihood I could see a lockout failure, but I'll tackle those if they show up. I'm happy to have this in until I can modify the D60 I have, three bearings are better than one I hear.

[Digger]

Nice!

I like the flexibity and additional robustness of FF axles.

[Justin]

Cool! I can't remember, does it use Dana 44 spindles and hubs?

[Kinder]

Yes and no, it's modeled after the 44 but the spindles are machined for the 9" housing bolt pattern. The hubs may be a direct fit, I'll have to do a little comparison next time I service the 44.

[Justin]

Gotcha. I figured the spindles were custom from warn, but the hub retainers looked like the were dana 44.

[Kinder]

It's a nice old kit, hubs are aluminum and the lock ring for the bearing adjustment uses set screws for extra retention. The bearings are made in the US and I must have a later production kit as mine includes the O rings on the hubs, that is where some of the leakage was reported on this kit. I've found some cheap slugs for backup, most places are very proud of them.

[Gunnibronco]

If they are D44 slugs, then 70's Jeep Cherokee & Wagoneers with Quadra Trac might work. A friend has a 79 Chero and his slugs *looked* like they'd drop into my hubs. If I remember they were easy to get out, too. If someone bumps into one at a junk yard and wants to try.

[Kinder]

I'll look into it, there are a few comments about slugs in some factory full time 4wd vehicles, but most seem to be 19 spline not 30. I'll try to dig through a Dana book, should be able to find an answer.

[Kinder]

Had a little scare coming home the other day, my oil pressure wasn't right. I usually have 60+ psi at cold start & maintain 30+ psi warmed up, well I only had 40 psi at cold start. I bought a mechanical gauge today, thinking my sending unit was going out, hooked the new gauge up, all is good.

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[Kinder]

Scored a ugly and bashed 4bt oil pan the other day for $20, sometimes eBay isn't evil. Since I'll be cutting it up to actually clear my diff and pushing the other side out for additional capacity it'll suit my needs just fine. I'm thinking 12 quarts total when I'm done, 2 more than stock.

[Kinder]

Torque related failures or damn that 4bt hits like a couple of hammers.

1. Smallest leaf spring on drivers side cracked in half, Rox said my axle was dancing when I was yanking that trailer around.
2. Leaf pack centering pins, 1 sheared off and the other one bent.
3. U-joint of rear driveshaft at axle end binding, see line 1 above for reason.
4. 3 problems but all related; splines on 9" yoke wallowed out, crush sleeved crushed beyond original setting, pinion bearings going out.
5. Time will tell...

[akaFrankCastle]

Sounds like you need some upgrades. I remember you were planning a 609 front. What were the plans for the rear axle?

[Justin]

x2. Sounds like a 4 link could wind up being a durability upgrade if done right. Not sure there's a more durable leaf option.

[Digger]

Bronco leafs seem a little light for modern drivetrain torque/HP. (My right center pin was broken off with a 351W/NP435)

You could retro-fit some modern 1/2ton leafs with bigger center pins and swap the spring pads out for wider/longer versions and probably be alright.

[Kinder]

I've got a E350 D60 (full float, limited slip w/disc brakes) sitting in storage that needs to get cut down. I was trying to get through winter before I started in on my axle upgrades, I think I'll rebuild the pinion portion of my 9" and use shims instead of a crush sleeve. I added a longer thicker leaf to the bottom of my pack when I replaced the centering pin, it should help control the wrap a little.

I'm not against going up to 1/2 ton truck leafs, I think Corey did this when he put his bigger axles in. I have the materials to build my own anti-wrap bar for my 9" or D60, it'll go on no matter what suspension and axle combo I end up with.

I'm still undecided on my final suspension setup for the rear, mostly because I ask so much from my bronco and have many swappable configurations.

[Justin]

Links with coilovers. Then you could change spring rates and ride height during the seasons you've got your camper installed. Or set it up with shocks and coils that are easily sourced. Using standard 2.5 or 3" springs would allow you to swap in as many different rates as you wanted and they're fairly cheap if you're willing to buy used.

[Colorado75bronc]

I still have eb leafs, I'd recommend you do like digger said, maybe run some f150 or FSB leafs as the are three inch wide, it'd be easy as the hangers are riveted on the full sizes so you can just cut/ air hammer or torch off the rivet heads and take the leafs, shackles and hangers in one shot then weld or bolt them on your bronco then build a torque/ anti wrap bar.
I'd stay away from coil overs due to the amount of towing you do, leafs tend to handle better with towing and then no adjustment needed, very simple and much less maintainence. I used to have super lift leaf packs on my 79' and they rode nice and were very flexible.

[Kinder]

You guys are having an out loud discussion of what goes on in my head, and I thank you for it. Maybe I should list up some of the past, present and future configurations and uses of my "nonco" (that's what my wife calls it).

BSD configs to date:
- no doors or soft doors w/ soft top - summer time setup for trails, camping and daily driving
- 4 steel doors w/ soft top & loaded bronco trailer (elec brakes)- fall hunting setup, grunt duty w/ snow & mud trail work
- 4 steel doors w/ camper w/ or w/out loaded bronco trailer - alternate fall hunting setup
- any of the above, but swap out the bronco trailer for a 16 ft tandem axle flatbed (elec brakes)
- plow work - w/ or w/out camper, but no trailer

Interior layout at the moment - pieced together 3/4 cage, 4 stock bucket seats, small job box mounted over the rear axle (single box of mechanic tools and small camping items stay in this), 1-2 jump seats at rear tailgate, just added the small HF bed crane (1/2 ton capacity), recovery gear and compressed gas bottle.

Containers that are added or removed based on need - spares, camping, winter, ranger (park work only).

Yikes! That is a lot of junk!

[Justin]

What's your ideal end goal? Load carrying? Ride quality? Pure bad-assedness?

[Digger]

Sounds like you will need some frame upgrades!

[Kinder]

End goal moves at a factor of ideas that I think up. I do need a minimum load carrying capacity, ideally this is the weight of the built camper w/ gear and the tongue weight of the loaded bronco trailer. I think I can tease this number out as I've weighed all of the big items and I can guess my gear weight.

I have done the tiniest bit of thinking on frame upgrades, nothing beyond adding an additional true cross member at the moment. If I was an engineer type I'd want to determine what the factory frame capabilities are, then move in the appropriate direction.

[Justin]

How willing are you to add a sway bar? Leaves are often better for load carrying because stiction within the spring creates a situation where it takes more force/energy to get them to move, resulting in better stability at the cost of ride and flex. Coils get rid of the stiction, allowing you to tune the behavior of the suspension, but you'd end up with more complexity. If you want a workhorse, I'd stick with leaves and make the switch to a set of 63" Chevy springs out of a 1/2 ton. You'll pick up travel with the longer leaves, and keep some of the stability inherent in the design. If you're going for off-road prowess I'd link it, but you're almost guaranteed to need a sway bar to control the added weight up high when you've got the camper in. You won't be able to run coilovers, as I don't think you can extend your wheelwells to accommodate the shocks and still run your camper. It comes down to end use, but you know that. For what you've been doing with it, leaves are likely the better option if you can address the durability issues.