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Digger's '69 Build Thread
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Jesus_man
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:36 am Posts: 5984 Location: California
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ 1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow. http://www.ucora.org
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Fri Nov 18, 2016 9:57 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
Well, the ZF5 got pissed on the way to work and I had to pull over and decided to have a friend drag me home to avoid more damage. I was bummed. I bought the trans freshly rebuilt from a shop that the owner was retiring. Everything appeared in good working order and I got 12,000 miles without issue until 2 weeks ago. Lately, driving to work on really cold mornings, I would hear a quick "zing" noise from what I thought was the trans, but it would only happen once, real quick and only on mornings when the truck was cold, the air temp was sub-30F and only on the interstate in OD @ 75mph. This would only happen every 5th time under only those conditions, making it real hard to diagnose the problem. Well 2 weeks ago, with an air temp of 24F, it happened 10 miles into my commute, then again and again every 1/8 mile. It didn't take long before everytime I heard the noise, you could feel the truck bog down. I popped the t-case in neutral and coasted off the interstate. By the time I got onto the frontage road, the trans was pissed and could stall the engine when letting the clutch out with both trans and t-case in neutral. I was guessing either input bearing or secondary shaft bearings. By the time my friend showed up, things had cooled off and were operating normal again. Not to risk it, we strapped it and tow it home. I dropped the trans and last week with a friend in town, we cracked the case open. I was relieved to find nothing major like giant metal flakes. The fluid was a little dark and the magnet seem to have an excess of sludge on it. by , on Flickr We pulled the gear cluster and at a glance, things looked to be in good condition. Main shaft bearing were good, but counter-shaft bearings looked a little dull with signs of high axial loading. by , on Flickr by , on Flickr by , on Flickr This was my suspicion all along. Reading the S5-42 service manual, proper preload is important to the bearings due to case expansion. I bought a 3-jaw internal puller and yanked both bearing cups. The only shim was the original single spacer the factory would have used after performing statistical analysis of the mfg tolerance stacks. Best I can tell, when the thing was rebuilt, it was just ped back together and no one checked preload. With a cold case, the aluminum would have contracted tighter on the bearings until the ATF could no longer penetrate the space between the rollers and the bearings went dry. SO, now bearings are on order and I get to run through the pre-load procedure.
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
Last edited by Digger on Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:16 am |
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Kinder
Official CCB Member
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:03 pm Posts: 4371 Images: 0 Location: Parker, CO
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Re: New Member 69
I know this isn't fun for you but I always appreciate your engineering perspective on problems and learn as much as I can, I'm glad it's repairable.
_________________ Best to Date MPG: 26.6
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Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:53 am |
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Jesus_man
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:36 am Posts: 5984 Location: California
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ 1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow. http://www.ucora.org
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Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:45 am |
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Justin
Official CCB Member
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:04 am Posts: 6198 Images: 0 Location: Lakewood
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Re: New Member 69
x3. I'm glad your brain is in this club.
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Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:59 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
Thanks guys.
On the plus side:
1) I'm very happy with how I put everything together. Pulling the transmission was the easiest pull I have done. I only used 3 sockets, 3 end wrenches, an allen, a screwdriver, and a trans jack to remove the exhaust, driveshafts, t-case and trans.
2) The ZF5 is very serviceable. Hands down the easiest teardown I have done on a manual. Most light and mini truck transmissions require partial disassembly of the gear cluster to break them down. Usually 5th and reverse gears are behind a partition within the case. The ZF splits the case very easy and the entire gear cluster is removed as one unit. There are a number of special tools require for a full break down, but that is nothing unique for a transmission.
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:09 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
Slow progress lately, but moving forward. I ordered bearings and seals. Pushed the new bearings on tonight. I had a serious when I priced out the recommended bearing puller from Ford. $1700!!! So I did what everyone else does: by , on Flickr by , on Flickr by , on Flickr by , on Flickr After cleaning the case mating surfaces thoroughly, I dropped in the counter-shaft and laid the housings together. I went about measuring preload/clearance backwards, but I figured there was a good chance the spacer was too big. Using shims, I evened the gap all the way around the housing halves and spun the shaft a few times to get it seated well. Feeler gage was telling me that I still have .0050"-.0055" gap, meaning there was about .002" too much preload on the shaft. I will take it back apart tomorrow and use the lathe and a Dremel as a make-shift surface grinder and take ~.003-.004" off the spacer and push the pre-load into the middle of its allowable range. by , on Flickr by , on Flickr
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
Last edited by Digger on Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Tue Feb 07, 2017 11:16 pm |
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Kinder
Official CCB Member
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:03 pm Posts: 4371 Images: 0 Location: Parker, CO
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Re: New Member 69
Love the bearing puller, I wonder if my diff bearing puller could have been able to do the work. Question, is the preload checked with only the case weight "loading" the bearing?
_________________ Best to Date MPG: 26.6
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Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:52 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Thu Feb 09, 2017 5:59 pm |
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Kinder
Official CCB Member
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:03 pm Posts: 4371 Images: 0 Location: Parker, CO
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Re: New Member 69
Cool, I'll have to pull my PTO cover next time I work on my drivetrain and take a measurement.
_________________ Best to Date MPG: 26.6
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Thu Feb 09, 2017 6:31 pm |
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Jesus_man
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:36 am Posts: 5984 Location: California
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ 1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow. http://www.ucora.org
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Thu Feb 09, 2017 7:40 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
Honestly, I'm surprised it had a problem. Bearings are so exact, they are essentially interchangeable, even between manufacturers without issue. Tolerances are plus/minus .00025". Even with two bearings, tolerance stack is still minimal. The OE bearings had to have been on one end of the tolerance band and the new bearings on the other AND the transmission would have been setup with near maximum preload.
At least that's how I see it.
Statistically, most should be fine, but the right procedure is to check lash/preload every time.
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:01 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
A little catch up:
Before putting the transmission back in, I took a detour and designed/machined an AN quick disconnect fitting to match the factory Ford hydraulic clutch fitting. by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
Then, recently, installed a front sway bar by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
Last edited by Digger on Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:40 pm |
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Eck
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:33 pm Posts: 2460
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Re: New Member 69
Jerk!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
_________________ 69 Wagon, 351W, Explorer EFI & Serpentine, ZF5, 35" tires, 3.5 SL, 2 BL, WARN 8274
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:07 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
And swapped in smaller injectors, which fixed an uneven fueling issue at WOT by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
...a 2nd 1BAR baro sensor so the computer can comp for altitude on the fly (vs at startup). This isn't finished yet, but I needed it functional before heading up to the mountains. I'll make a nice housing later. by , on Flickr
I also bought some nice roll cage padding at Todd Z's suggestion. This stuff is dual durometer and SFI rated. by , on Flickr
Then added a P3 brake controller, which required opening up 3/4 of the wiring harness. by , on Flickr
and cleaned up some wiring by , on Flickr
All so I could do this safely: by , on Flickr
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
Last edited by Digger on Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:08 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:10 am |
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Eck
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:33 pm Posts: 2460
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Re: New Member 69
I just mean that I hate how capable you are if making your own stuff...
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
_________________ 69 Wagon, 351W, Explorer EFI & Serpentine, ZF5, 35" tires, 3.5 SL, 2 BL, WARN 8274
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:20 am |
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Strike2
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:34 am Posts: 808
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Re: New Member 69
Nice custom upgrades! How much weight is that trailer and how's it tow with the bronco? That front sway bar sure is beefy
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 6:52 am |
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Kinder
Official CCB Member
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:03 pm Posts: 4371 Images: 0 Location: Parker, CO
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New Member 69
Serious Thumbs Up! Especially the camping pic.
_________________ Best to Date MPG: 26.6
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:38 am |
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Justin
Official CCB Member
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:04 am Posts: 6198 Images: 0 Location: Lakewood
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Re: New Member 69
Wait, you're supposed to drive them? Looks great, esp like the new camper.
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 11:12 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:33 pm |
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Jesus_man
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:36 am Posts: 5984 Location: California
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Re: New Member 69
Some really nice upgrades! Do you pl an to disconnect to the way bar for offroading?
_________________ 1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow. http://www.ucora.org
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Sun Jun 11, 2017 7:07 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: New Member 69
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Sun Jun 11, 2017 1:51 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
This week I got around to re-hosting many of the pictures that were lost on this thread thanks to the Photobucket debacle.
It's been a year and a half now, so I'm happy to get the build pictures back.
I had been fighting a weird glitch with the ignition system and replaced darn near every component trying to fix it, including the computer. The only thing left was the ignition trigger in the MSD. Looking for more accuracy and moving towards getting rid of the distributor, I designed and machined a 36-1 Ford-style trigger wheel and sensor bracket.
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
Last edited by Digger on Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:12 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
I got a new steering wheel for my birthday.
by , on Flickr
Since then, I have been working on refining little things. I decided to switch intake manifolds and ordered one from Edelbrook on Jun 3rd.
After many, many backorder notices, missed dates and a lot of back and forth, they finally delivered it after I got home from SEMA, 5 MONTHS after the order was placed. It has been extremely frustrating and forced me to take stock of where I was in the project and what was left to do.
Besides a new winch bumper and some minor items, the biggest to-dos revolved around engine upgrades like a serpentine belt system, further EFI refinement and adding a catalytic converter and an aux fuel tank. It was still of a lot of work and even after all that I would have a vehicle that only gets 14 mpg at best. I have had a long term plan to go diesel and while at SEMA I took a second look at Cummins' crate diesel engine.
Cummins recently improved the engine calibration and pushed the little R2.8 to 310 lb-ft of torque. This made it a lot more appealing, especially since it weighs the same as the 351W and has an acceptable RPM range, which means no spring or gear changes. After a few nights calculating return on investment and selling my motorcycle a month ago, I decided to pull the trigger.
Delivered by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
Unpacking by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
by , on Flickr
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:33 pm |
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phyler
Official CCB Member
Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2010 9:41 pm Posts: 1201 Location: Erie
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
I love this line: "I designed and machined a 36-1 Ford-style trigger wheel and sensor bracket." You say that as if it is as easy as making a PBJ sandwich. Love watching your build. Wish I had a tenth of your smarts.
Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
_________________ 1975 Ranger Edition that I've had longer than I've been without it.
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Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:27 am |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:22 pm |
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Jesus_man
Official CCB Member
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:36 am Posts: 5984 Location: California
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
Did you see the R2.8 in the rolling chassis at SEMA?
_________________ 1973 Bronco, 351 SEFI, Locked, discs, 35's ZF-5spd and Atlas 4spd. 235:1 Crawl Ratio. It may be ugly, but it's slow. http://www.ucora.org
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Thu Dec 20, 2018 3:11 pm |
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Digger
Official CCB Member
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:53 pm Posts: 1276
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
_________________ Cummins R2.8 diesel, ZF5, AtlasII, HP44/BB9, ARBs, coiled / linked suspension, 37" KO2s, full cage, bumpers, etc. Build Thread:
Average 23.5 mpg, Best tank: 25.1 mpg
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Thu Dec 20, 2018 10:04 pm |
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cw72
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:04 am Posts: 113 Location: Denver, CO
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Re: Digger's '69 Build Thread
The 2.8 is very cool, I look forward to seeing your progress and hear your reviews. That’s a motor swap I’ve considered as well.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Tue Dec 25, 2018 11:11 pm |
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